Hypothetical Football Monday

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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby eochs on Tue Nov 01, 2016 1:07 pm

So its not Les Miles?
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby 12ozLongneck on Tue Nov 01, 2016 1:51 pm

It's not not Miles until Frazier says it is Miles unless that only works in elections.
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby edavis3 on Mon Nov 14, 2016 8:56 am

So....he's gone now, right?

Read an article yesterday saying that the TCU game now decides if he stays or goes. I think it's already over. At least I hope so.

Thoughts?
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby Drew Corleone on Mon Nov 14, 2016 9:19 am

7-5 with a bowl win? Maybe. But I think you have to make a decision before the bowl. You can't let recruiting sit for the weeks. I suspect he is probably done but we did not look the same on Saturday that we looked early in the season.
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby UTwiz on Mon Nov 14, 2016 10:55 am

We are playing better collectively vs earlier this year, but we are still underachieving individually and collectively vs less talented players/units.

We are still being out-coached tactically and strategically, still leaving points on the field, and still making awful coaching decisions. Every game.

This subject should NOT be discussed in the context of what is the bare minimum required for Strong to save his job. It should be discussed in the context of whether or not Strong gives this football program a competitive advantage over an alternative. And the obvious answer is, no, he does not.

It's time.
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby HornMafia on Mon Nov 14, 2016 10:59 am

I've heard 7-5 is enough.
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby UTwiz on Mon Nov 14, 2016 11:35 am

I've heard he's already been told (weeks ago) that if he did not finish the season at 8-4, Perrin could not assure him there would be enough support to retain him, and that the decision has already been made.

So.
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby edavis3 on Mon Nov 14, 2016 1:23 pm

What I noticed more than anything on Saturday was that when we enter the red zone, nobody knows what to do. Bad play calling and bad execution in the red zone....hard to win games that way.

You have to blame a majority of that on the coaching staff.
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby txlonghorn47 on Mon Nov 14, 2016 1:27 pm

I think too many people have talked themselves into the team looking improved and I've resided myself to the huge disappointment that he'll be back. We'll hear great things in the offseason only to go out and get skull fucked by USC early just to end up back in this same situation next year. Then we'all limp to 8-4/7-5 again and once again it'll be a narrative of false hope.

The TLDR version......just kill me now.
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby txlonghorn47 on Mon Nov 14, 2016 1:31 pm

If by some miracle we do make a change then yes Drew you are correct. It has to be done well before a bowl game. In fact I'd say it probably needs to happen Saturday or Sunday after the TCU game.
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby LMQueen on Mon Nov 14, 2016 2:16 pm

My prediction is 7-5 he stays and 6-6 he's gone.




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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby HornMafia on Mon Nov 14, 2016 2:19 pm

edavis3 wrote:What I noticed more than anything on Saturday was that when we enter the red zone, nobody knows what to do. Bad play calling and bad execution in the red zone....hard to win games that way.

You have to blame a majority of that on the coaching staff.


Freshman players do freshmen things. I know people get sick of hearing that but impatience doesn't magically turn them into Juniors.
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby UTwiz on Mon Nov 14, 2016 3:38 pm

WV returned five starters total from last year's team. We returned quite a bit more than that. Our team might be young from an age perspective, but we have more game experience than other teams.

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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby UTwiz on Mon Nov 14, 2016 3:47 pm

Also, there should be absolutely nothing predicated on the final results of games #36 and #37 (against the worst P5 team in the country and a severely average TCU team QBed by Kenny Hill). Games #1 - #35 are a much more important data set. This isn't complicated. We will learn nothing during the next two games that we don't already know.

He's not the guy to deliver a championship. Once that has been established, a consolation prize of a fourth year is irrelevant.
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby txlonghorn47 on Tue Nov 15, 2016 8:36 am

Scipio wrote a pretty good article pretty much saying what Jeremy said above. This shouldn't come down to the next two games. Even if he wins out he's what? 17-19 in three seasons? We talk about young players. Have you really seen any of them get better this year? Malik? Regressed. John Burt? Regressed. Hilton Hill? Regressed. Duvante Davis? Regressed. Patrick Vahe? Regressed. These were all guys that were thought to be "stars" last year. Connor Williams is an absolute stud, but other than him who from that "stellar" 2015 class gets you really excited? I mean the team is being carried by a 2 star recruit from Macks supposedly bare cupboard, who by the way mostl likely isn't back next year. And I've stated it before this was easily the easiest schedule he's had in his 3 years here and we still are talking ourselves into hoping we make it to 7-5. I see all the boneheaded game management and you hear other coaches talk about how poorly prepared this team is every week. It's time to go.....it's time.
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby 12ozLongneck on Tue Nov 15, 2016 9:42 am

But Charlie is starting a team of high school juniors and every other team in the Big XII is a clone of 1995 Nebraska!!!
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby HornMafia on Tue Nov 15, 2016 10:43 am

You guys keep harping on the record, but we all know this was a tear it down to the studs rebuild. Not only the talent, but the culture and very fabric of what this program was.

Then he had to deal with Steve Patterson.

He put himself behind the 8 ball bringing Watson in. 100 percent on him. But we all knew this was going to be rough. Fuck, just look at the last two graduating seniors.

So you fire Charlie. The next guy has to win...10 games next year? Is that the bar? So if the next guy doesn't win 20 in two years you want him fired, too?

We cannot go into a Tennessee like cycle. The next guy HAS to be the guy or we are set back another 5-8 years.

And you are willing to bet all that on Tom Herman, who has lost to Navy and SMU and had way too close games with Tulane, Tulsa and UCF?

You have enough evidence that he can make all the hires needed to win 20 games the next two years?
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby 12ozLongneck on Tue Nov 15, 2016 11:12 am

No, but I would bet good money he would go over 500 in three years and not have to fire pretty much all of the original staff he puts together when he gets the job here within 3 years.
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby edavis3 on Tue Nov 15, 2016 11:19 am

HornMafia wrote:You guys keep harping on the record


WE are harping on the fact that the record shows no progress.

To reverse your argument, if he goes 7-5 for 2 more years, do we just still keep waiting?

It's been 3 years...3...with NO actual, tangible signs of progress. Does anyone feel this year, that if we beat TCU and go 7-5 that progress was made? Anyone?

He will not change as a coach, he's just not a great coach. 1 or 2 more years will not change who Charlie Strong is as a coach, so in turn, it won't change who Texas is as a program.

Remember this if he gets another year and we get destroyed by USC next year.
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby txlonghorn47 on Tue Nov 15, 2016 12:04 pm

Serious question....are you that confident that this team could beat Navy right now? Because I'm not at all.
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby HornMafia on Tue Nov 15, 2016 12:36 pm

edavis3 wrote:To reverse your argument, if he goes 7-5 for 2 more years, do we just still keep waiting?


No. I have been on record saying just about any coach should get 4 years to see guys he had some sort of a say in recruiting be Seniors.

Year 4 should see tangible results.

To me, you are firing a guy only to hire the guy that you hired 3 years ago (very successful coordinator with mixed results as a head coach at a mid-major).
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby edavis3 on Tue Nov 15, 2016 1:23 pm

HornMafia wrote:
edavis3 wrote:To reverse your argument, if he goes 7-5 for 2 more years, do we just still keep waiting?


No. I have been on record saying just about any coach should get 4 years to see guys he had some sort of a say in recruiting be Seniors.

Year 4 should see tangible results.

To me, you are firing a guy only to hire the guy that you hired 3 years ago (very successful coordinator with mixed results as a head coach at a mid-major).


I understand your 4 year stance...however, if there's no progress in the first 3, it's hard to get behind.
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby txlonghorn47 on Tue Nov 15, 2016 2:11 pm

Also wasn't aware that 21-3 with wins over two top 10 teams in a year and a half was now considered mixed results.....
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby 12ozLongneck on Tue Nov 15, 2016 2:18 pm

Let's start the bidding for a successful Herman era at "Never kicks off to begin both halves."
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Re: Hypothetical Football Monday

Postby UTwiz on Tue Nov 15, 2016 5:02 pm

I want to clear up a misconception here.

Talent has NEVER been the reason this program has gone 6-7, 5-7, and either 6-6 or 7-5. Neither has youth. Now, those two things might have contributed to individual and collective production at less than optimal levels during stretches. But neither are the cause of the severe underperformance in overall production or w/l column. Texas has had more or equal talent compared to the opponent for 85% of the games played over the last three years. And that talent dynamic mitigates almost all of the youth excuses. Guess what? Talented young players are better than untalented old players. Youth causes much different kinds of performance issues than talent.

The main drivers that have led to such poor performance/results the last three years are player-independent. Philosophy. Scheme. Coordinators/staff. Tactical coaching processes during the week. Game day decisions on Saturday. For all of these high impact coaching functions that are maintained outside of the player talent/age scale, Strong has been either very poor or very incongruent with this program and conference.

The age/talent dynamic might be the reason why Texas could not be expected to compete for championships the last three seasons, but it damn sure isn’t the reason why the program will finish below .500 after a three year sample size.
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